Saltwater fly reel

[UlrichsM]

Interested in shopping for a good, quality saltwater fly reel for a 10 wt line. Preferably black in color, left hand retrieve, very smooth drag. Looking for quality, but I'm not in the salt enough to justify buying brand new. Extra spool would also be welcomed. Ulrichsm@dcmoboces.com
Also, what kind of saltwater fly line is used 90% of the time?
What about leaders, especially for stripers: 12 lb tippets, 14 lb? Any info would be appreciated. M.

 

[njflyguy]

For the money I think you'd be hard pressed to beat a redfly from redington(sage now)....I used one in Alaska for salmon....nice smooth drag..good luck....

 

[Future Fanatic]

Mike,
BLACK IN COLOR?!!?
Does it have to match your waders or something?

Mike will be starting a new magazine in the spring, GQFLY, for men that want to look good while they fly fish.

Some of us just don't know how...

See you later.
John

 

[Fly Ty R]

NJFG:
I wouldn't recommend the RedFly reel for heavy saltwater use, especially for a 10wt line. I had one for about a year on my 8wt until it fell apart on me. Don't get me wrong, it's a great reel for the price for use in freshwater, but the salt will tear it up.

What I'd recommend, since I'm nowhere near affluent and because I do a ton of saltwater flying (I think I did over 100 days on the salt this year so far, according to my log):

Reel: Invest in a nice one. Bad ones only give you bad performance. If you take care of it, it will last you a very long time. I used a big Medalist on my 10wt for 5 years (1594, I think the model is), mostly fishing from the surf and jetties. It'll hold up, but don't count on it to land you a big striper or blue. The drag is nowhere near enough to handle them. I still have it as a backup, but I don't really use it anymore. I now have a Teton Tioga and a Redington RS2 reel for my 9 and 10 wts. I'd recommend them both because they aren't too expensive (Tioga was $150 brand new, probably cheaper on eBay or the like; RS2 was about $50 on eBay because of the manufacturer change to Sage, probably $150 or so brand new). I use them both heavily, and they work very well. The RS2 has a semi-large arbor, so it retrieves line a little faster than the Tioga. But I can put a lot more backing on the Tioga (300yds). By the way, both are black with interchangable left/right hand retrieves .

Fly Line: Invest in a good intermediate. Depending on the rod you have, get a 10 or 11 wt clear intermediate. I have the Airflo and it works great. I recommend the clear int because of the colder water we have around here. Mono core lines don't coil up as much in the cold water as other lines do. I'd recommend the Airflo because other clear intermediates don't perform as well. You can still use poppers on an int line, but top water subsurface is usually what you're looking for in the surf or back bays. Like Rob said, you'll be streamer fishing is 90% of the time. A good sinking line is useful as well. I have a Teeny TS-450 that sinks about 8 inches/second, and that's a good all around rate. It casts very well too. I can effectively fish to 20 ft depths or so. It's pretty easy to cast the entire line into the wind (100ft) too. The old Teeny running lines used to coil too much, but their new stock is thicker so it shoots better.

Leaders: Use a 6-7' straight shot of 20lb mono or fluoro for the surf/jetties with an intermediate. For the sinking line, go to 4 or 5 ft. In the back bays, a straight shot of 12 or 15lb line will work. Sometimes I go down to 6lb or 8lb on my 6wt, but that's only under certain circumstances. There is absolutely NO need for tapered leaders for Northeast saltwater fly fishing. You usually don't need delicate presentations, except for spooky fish at night, and even then a taper won't help you. Saltwater flies are too bulky to be affected by leader taper.

Hope this helps. This comes from trial and error experience, too, not something I read in a magazine .

 

[bjmiller]

As for reels, a lot depends on what you going after and how much you want to spend. For 10 wt for Stripers and Blues, I would want a reel that would hold at least 200 yds of 30lb backing. For the inexpensive side, the only Medalist that might handle that much backing would be the 1498. The 1495 might hold 100yds with a 10wt. The downsides to the Medalist are:
1) would need to make sure all screws are tight before you fish.
2) would require extensive cleanup after each use
3) Medalists are heavy (1495 is 6 oz)

A little more expensive reel that I would suggest is a Ross Gunnison. The G5 would handle a 10wt with about 175 to 200yds of backing and the reel is very light (under 5 oz) and tough as nails in the salt. You can get them in black if that's a concern, the drag is very smooth and the spool is very easy to change. The reel goes for about $250 or so new and the spool goes for about half of that.
For lines I use an intermediate (slow sink) 95% of the time but that also depends on where you fish and what you fish for. Up in the Northeast where the water is cooler, I use a Sci-Angler's Stillwater. It's clear and doesn't have as much memory as a lot of other lines do. In the South (Florida and Texas where I go) I use Bonefish and Tarpon flylines (Sci-Angler's) as they are stiffer and work better in the warmer water. Also, ALWAYS stretch you flyline before you fish. Your casts will be much longer if you do. (It's also not a bad idea to stretch you line in fresh water either ).
For stripers, I use a 12lb tippet, but if blues are around, I'll put on a 10" piece of 40lb shock tippet. I use a triple surgeon's to attach the shock to the class tippet and a loop knot to attach the fly. My leader is usually about 8 or 9 feet. I go from 40lb to 20lb to 12lb and maybe 4' butt, and 2' of the other 2 each.

 

[UlrichsM]

Fly Ty R & BJMiller

Thanks for the Salt info. Learned a lot from both of you. I'll take a closer look at the Redington RS2 & Tioga reels. I saw them both in a catalog of mine and both seem reasonably priced. Also, E-bay is auctioning a Tioga 10LA--I think. As far as flies are concerned, what size hooks should I concentrate in buying if I were to tie up my saltwater flies? I tie my own flies, but I really want to keep it basic. Is it 1, 1/0, 2/0. Some info on this would be appreciated. And fishing from the surf, is a stripping basket necessary?
Also, when I do get to Long Island to visit my sisters (Huntington), where would be the best spots to go? I don't seem to get a lot of help from the surrounding tackle shops.

 

[Fly Ty R]

BJM:
1498 Medalist. I think that's what I have. It holds about 100yds of 30lb backing with a 10wt floating line. Thanks! I thought the model number looked a little odd when I wrote it...

UM:
The Tioga 10LA should be a great reel. Go for it! You won't get as much backing onto it, but that shouldn't be a big deal. The good thing about Teton is that the LA and the standard arbor spools are interchangable, so you can get both for one reel. Keep checking eBay out, too. The retailers usually have close out specials on everything. I got the RS2 brand new and cheap because of that ($50). I'm guessing a Tioga would be around the same or a little more. The only thing I have a concern about with the RS2 is that the drag is pretty loose. I can tighten it way down with several turns of the knob to get a good drag, but that's not good for it in the long run. The Tioga's drag can be set tightly very quickly with only one turn of the knob. That might be one thing to consider. Really, the drag isn't too big of an issue when dealing with "normal" sized stripers and blues. But a striper over 20lb or a blue over 10lb will take your line fast; moreso with the blue than the striper. All you really need is enough drag to keep the spool from overrunning on the first big run, but sometimes after that it's good to tighten it down more than that. Each fish requires different methods.

As for fly tying, saltwater flies tend not to be a refined and revered as freshwater flies. You can be very successful using just deceivers and clousers in different sizes and colors. In fact, those are my go-to patterns. Sure, I tie the specialty patterns too, like crabs and shrimp because they are fun and look cool, but 9 out of 10 times you'll see a clouser or deceiver on the end of my tippet. For hooks, start with size 1/0. You can't go wrong with that size. A 1/0 hook will get you an average deceiver of about 4" and a clouser of about 3". That is around the standard size bait found in the NE. You can buy Mustad hooks in the 100 packs for several $$, or get the 5 packs of Varivas hooks for $5 each. It's your choice. Of course the Vari's will be much sharper and stronger, but if you fish around rocks or bluefish, do you really feel like losing $1 each time you break off?? After you get the 1/0, then you can go on and get size 4 to 4/0. Those are the general sizes used for 99% of patterns. Or you can get them all at once. Bucktail and saddle hackles in different colors will be the basic materials for the flies. And don't forget about the dumbbell eyes for the clousers. If you want some more specific patterns and such, e-mail me at my address (I think it's on here). I don't want to use up all the bandwidth for this site...

Stripping basket: In a word, use one and learn to like it! Fishing in the surf without on will drive you insane. You can get by without one if you mainly fish from a boat, sod bank, or rocks, but it just makes everything easier.

 

[bjmiller]

Hook size depends on the bait you're trying to imitate. Sand eels, spearing, peanut bunker, and crabs, I use 1/0, which is most of it. I use a stripping basket whether fishing from the surf or a boat. It's especially important from the surf as line control is of great importance. Without a basket, the surf will have control of your line, not you. Haven't fished Long Island much in recent years, used to belong to the Salty Flyrodders and participated in their get together each June out on the North Fork. Great fun!! The only other place I fished the surf on Long Island was at West Meadow Beach near Northport in June and at night. I think the mouth of the Nissequoge is supposed to be good also. But it's very dependent on water temps, tide, and bait availability. Landed my first 20lber at West Meadow a bunch of years ago at night on a 1/0 white snake fly. Have had 30+ fish nights at times also. In recent years though, I've been fishing the Sound from a boat with some friends out of Norwalk and Mamaroneck during the daylight hours. Can be very productive.

 

[njflyguy]

TYR...My redfly hasn't that kind of use...and there is a fair it never will, however in retrospect I think I had to squeeze 150 yds of backing on with an 8 weight line....anything heavier and it'd have been 100 yds...I use it the few times I have been to the shore...took a nice weakfish in the Barnegat Bay on a crazy charlie...but I suppose if salt were more my thing I'd upgrade...it's a shame I don't head south more, but since the inlaws moved west we don't have as much reason to go down to the house in Seaside Park....I'm sure you can imagine the hassles....

 

[Fly Ty R]

Rob,
Like I said, I used the Medalist for 5 years before I upgraded. I still use a smaller one for my 7wt. There is nothing wrong with them, but I wouldn't want to risk losing a 20lb+ fish because of it. That's why I switched. I'm tougher on my tackle than most, and my reels are still in working order . Gees, I think I've dropped my reels on the rocks and sand more times than I can remember. They've got dings and scratches, but still work like new. I always take them apart and clean them under the tap after every trip. That's a MUST with saltwater tackle. A good thing to remember is, if you drop a reel in the sand, don't try to use it immediately afterwards if you have other alternatives. If that's your only reel and you're 10 miles away from the parking lot, then you can chance rinsing it off in the water. But if you have another reel or can go home quickly, don't even think of rinsing it off in saltwater. Use another reel in the meantime and when you get home just rinse off the first one until all the sand is out. As long as you don't try to force the reel to spin with sand in it, it won't get hurt.

I found out the drag wasn't sufficient on my 1495 Medalist earlier this spring on my 7wt. I got a nice sized tiderunner weakie that kept pulsing line off the reel in short 20-30 yd bursts. The spool overran even though I had the drag down as tight as it could go. And of course the line tangled and I lost the fish. Snapped my 14lb tippet like thread. I couldn't imagine if it was a 10lb+ blue. The reel might have broken off at the seat with that tangle, or the guides might have ripped off in the initial run!

 

[UlrichsM]

Anti-reverse Saltwater Reels?

Gentlemen,

What exactly is an anti-reverse reel, and is it necessary for saltwater fly fishing from the shore? Or is it overkill? Is it preferable to the conventional fly reels? And if stripping baskets are necessary, which types? Any info would be appreciated.

 

[Fly Ty R]

Reels:
Anti-reverse and doubling reels are considered overkill by most salties. They are a good thing to look into if you are considering fishing for big tuna or other pelagics a lot. Tuna and others swim so fast that a single-action reel will spin wildly as they run. With an anti-reverse, you can keep your hand on the handle as the fish is running, like a spinning or conventional reel. A doubling reel (I know you didn't ask about it, but it's in the same category) allows the spool to retrieve line faster, unlike a 1:1 ratio single action does. This is also good for pelagic fish when they swim towards you. You have to retrieve the line fast enough so they don't spit the hook, which is virtually impossible anyway, but a doubler helps.

The reason they are considered overkill is because of all the moving parts. Saltwater reels are much more reliable when they have almost no moving parts. Less moving parts = less things that can go wrong. Also, salt and sand find their way into everything, so the less there is to get stuck, the better. The best reel for a surf, jetty, or backwater angler would be a single action standard or large arbor with a closed center drag. Very few moving parts and easy to take care of. Also less expensive . Large arbor reels help you retrieve line faster, but they also have less backing capacity. There is a trade-off, but with local inshore species, it's not too big of a deal. Unless you get into big albies and bonito, then it could get iffy.

Stripping baskets:
For working the surf, get a basket that has plenty of drain holes. This is because if you get hit with a wave, the basket will drain quickly and not bog you down. For the backwater, get one with no drains. When you wade deep, the water will seep into the basket and make a mess of your line. I use only one basket, one I made. It is entirely sealed with no drain holes, and I make do in the surf. I just try not to get swamped by the waves, which is easier said than done! If it gets filled, I just tip the basket up towards me and the water drains out over my waders. A basket with cone inserts works the best, but you can use plastic tie downs, heavy mono, weed whacker cord, or anything else. These help seperate the line so it shoots easier and doesn't come out of the basket in one big clump. I'm sure you can find some designs on the Web. I bought a clear plastic storage box from K-Mart, put pre-made cone inserts in it, and put my wading belt through it. It's works great and it cheap. You can also buy the Orvis model, but it'll cost you.

 

[BigBrownE]

Mike

From what everyone suggested will suffice for the SALT. Thats what I have come to find on this board. All very useful information.

This is what I carry and come equipped with when I venture to the NJ coast.

Rods: 1 - 10' x 10wgt, 1-9'6" x 8 wgt, 1 - 9' surf casting spin rod

Lines - My fly reels are equipped with Airflo intermediate and sinking lines(350 grain). Can't go wrong with Airflo, great lines that hold up in the colder water and shoot extremely well through the rod guides.

Reels - I have Orvis LA (8wgt) and a Redington RS2 (10wgt). Don't skimp on the reel too much. This is what fights the fish. In my opinion try to stay away from cork drag reels. They have been known to literally explode on you if the reel gets drenched and you tie into a BEEFY fish. The RS2 is a reasonably priced reel that has a nice smooth drag. Can't go wrong with Orvis or other reels out there.

Stripping basket - go to wal-mart, k-mart, etc and buy a deep dish washing bucket. By deep I mean 10-12". Deep is key, during windy days or heavy surf it will eliminate your line from getting picked up and tossed out of your bucket. You can make your own for less than $10. Buy some weed wacker string, make holes in your bucket big enough to thread 6" or longer pieces of string to create "loops". Glue string w/ GOOP or melt ends w/ lighter or match. You want to make at least 6-8 loops in your bucket. Also drill drain holes in the bucket for water to drain.

Leaders - 7 ' leaders maximum length to 12-15lb tippet. I prefer clear leader material when I make my own. I have friends who just use a 5' straight piece of 15lb for a leader from their fly line.

Flies - clousers, decievers, jiggies, half & halfs, will get you by. don't forget poppers too. Bobs bangers and others are out there to select from but don't go over board.

The SALT game is not the easiest by any means from shore. You will have to put in time and be willing to be mobile. Once you experience your first blitz or big bass on a fly, you will be addicted for sure.

One other recommendation is if you have a surf rod take it with you. It sometimes saves a long hard day on the water. Sometimes the fish are just out of reach w/ the long rod and the extra distance gained by a spin surf casting rod will enable you to reach the fish.

This years fall run has been exceptional to say the least. In fact its not over yet. Time will tell after this storm but we could have fish till x-mas on the fly.

Good luck in your Salt quest. If you have any other questions email me at info@flyfishpa.net

Dean
Fly Fish PA, LLC
www.flyfishpa.net

 

[willowhead]

saltwater reels

Mike, i have quite a few Teton reels, and the Tioga is just the cheaper version, same drag, but a bit heavier because of less venting, (especially in/on the spool). The Tioga also does not have as good a finish on it as the Teton, but your going to have to COMPLETELY wash and rinse your reel, line, AND backing each and everytime you go in the salt anyway. If you don't you WILL regret it. You can't get a better reel for the money, than a Teton, OR a Tioga. I also have the Ross Gunnison reel, but i haven't tried it in the salt yet either. My wife hooked us up a deal where we can get anything Reddington makes for 60% off retail, but i've never used anything of theirs in the salt, YET! so i can't speak on that. But i DO love their products for fresh water use. Their new top of the line rods are GREAT! Extremely light yet powerful. Good luck, mark (willowhead) www.JazzMarkGallery.com